247: Why You Should Rip Up Your 5-Year Plan

Maxie McCoy 00:01
I just asked myself this all the time, I probably asked myself yesterday. What is the absolute smallest thing that I can do right now to do something about this energy, this good energy?

Introduction 00:03
This is the Happen To Your Career podcast, with Scott Anthony Barlow. We help you stop doing work that doesn't fit you, figure out what does and make it happen. We help you define the work that's unapologetically you, and then go get it. If you're ready to make a change, keep listening. Here's Scott. Here's Scott. Here's Scott.

Scott Anthony Barlow 00:40
Okay, so here's the thing. We go into our jobs or different areas of our life thinking we know what we want. And you know what, sometimes we do and we go into that, and maybe we get a new job. And maybe it's great for a little while, but then something happens, something happens that causes us to realize that what we thought we wanted before isn't what we want now, you know, maybe it's a... your company got purchased, and you've got a merger. And now guess what, it is a different scenario, different playing field, or maybe it's on the other side where you have had a child or realize that, you know, what you wanted when you came out of college is no longer what you want anymore, and your needs have changed. And you know what? There's nothing wrong with that. But then, if we don't know exactly what we're doing, and we don't have the five year plan all figured out, why is it that many of us feel lost or stuck at that point? That's what we wanted to talk to Maxie McCoy, friend of the podcast, one of my personal friends, she's been on before, you've heard her way back in Episode 199. You can go back and listen to her entire story there. However, she's on today to talk about what happens when you do feel that way. What happens when you feel lost. And what do you do about it.

Maxie McCoy 02:10
I think it's really important to understand where that feeling comes from. And I'll tell you a little bit about why I started to write about this feeling just in general was, you know, I was on the road talking to women for a vast majority of my career, which is such a gift. And the thing that I heard over and over and over, and Scott, what was so interesting is it cut across demographics, it didn't matter if it was 50 year old woman making the change from having her children to starting her first company post-divorce. Or if it was a young 22 year old woman who now didn't have the exact path in front of her. I was hearing it in every city, in every country, just this I feel so lost. And it just started to click with me because I had felt that way. You know, if you go back and you listen to that origin episode between me and you so much of about that was this feeling of being lost at different points in my career. So I mean, I felt it. I don't know if there's anyone who hasn't felt it at some point in their career. But I think it really stems from a couple things, right? So there's the loss that comes from not understanding what your big picture is. We obsess over this big goal, and we want to have it all figured out. And we expect that of ourselves. Then there's the loss that comes from, okay, I kind of have a sense of direction. But I have no idea what happens between here and there. Right. And so there's these different pathways of getting to that. But what I really believe is that, at our core, none of us are actually lost, we just start believing in ourselves enough to take the tiny steps that will open that path up.

Scott Anthony Barlow 04:03
So let me ask you a little bit about that. Because last time, we got to have a really cool conversation about confidence. And we spend most of our time, last time we brought you on the show, talking about what that is. And to some degree, confidence is believing in yourself, right? I mean, you can go deep into detail on the definition of it, and how to get confidence and everything else like that. But really, I'm curious what you mean, when you say, believing in yourself enough. What does that look like? Yeah.

Maxie McCoy 04:34
What does that actually. I know. It is confidence, right? But we don't self diagnose as like, "Oh, I'm not confident." Like when I look back on all the times that I felt lost, in the moment was never like, "Oh, I just don't feel confident" but when you return, really what that means, believing in yourself is returning to a really deep tapped in power. I'll give you the actual definition of confidence just so we know what I'm talking about, and I use confidence and self belief interchangeably. And it's how much you believe that your abilities and whatever it is that you try your hand at will have a positive outcome. So when you take it back to, you know, how can I take small step after small step to really end up finding my way, it's believing that those small steps are going to have a positive outcome. So when you say, what does it feel like? What does it smell like? You're actually like leading me to one of the things that I think about a lot when I have my own experiences of not believing in myself, I mean, you and I were just talking about how, you know, kind of going into this place of expansion and doing some of the things that I'm doing right now, man, I get hit by the wave of like, "Oh, I'm not sure if I can do this. I'm not sure if I believe in my abilities all the time." And it really is coming back to your power, knowing that the things that you're doing, will have that positive outcome. And I think that there's a lot of reasons that we don't believe in ourselves. And I think that's a really important place to start, which is, you look at cultural constructions, you look at all the molds that exist that people are expecting us to fit into. You look at the patriarchy, you look at social media, and all of these highlight reels. I mean, there's so much going on right now, that kind of little by little tears that our ability to feel really tapped into ourselves. And what it is about is it is coming back to the highest expression of who you are. I tell people all the time, look at all the things someone has ever told you to change. And you actually have your formula for really tapping into your own power and the highest expression of yourself in reverse. Because what you should do is go magnify all of that, if you like writing really weird poems, go do that. Even if people think that they're weird. People have been telling you to look a certain way or talk quieter. It's like, Scott, I don't know about you. But my whole life, people told me that I talked too much. And now I make a lot of money talking too much. You know what I mean? So it's, we really do have these formulas for how to be the highest expression of ourselves, via all the things people have told us to change.

Scott Anthony Barlow 07:18
I love that. When you first said that, I didn't quite follow what you were talking about. But I think that is possibly one of the most useful indicators. And it's totally counterintuitive from the way that most of us are looking at it. Because most of us are looking at that, and we hear somebody saying, "Yeah, you're too loud, or you talk too much" or whatever it might be. And we think that well, we need to do something about that. However, there's something that we need to do, I think is usually more along the lines of "How do I talk quieter?" or whatever it might be.

Maxie McCoy 07:52
It's like, how do I start a podcast with that?

Scott Anthony Barlow 07:54
Yeah. And it needs to be in reverse from what they're...

Maxie McCoy 07:57
What they're saying.

Scott Anthony Barlow 07:58
Yeah. And that's actually... I love that. I love that. Every time I talk to you, I come away with so many good, I don't know, analogies and quips and quotes and... you're so tweetable.

Maxie McCoy 08:10
I think it's all the sports broadcasting media training in me.

Scott Anthony Barlow 08:14
So I think that's a really very relevant way to look at it in terms of looking at all the things that people have told you. And essentially, in a lot of cases, doing the opposite, if it's not something that's encouraging, probably doing the opposite. So where else do we look for that source of confidence?

Maxie McCoy 08:34
I think one of the places like when you're thinking about the highest expression of yourself, and you really are trying to tap into those, you know, just those like that superpower, that feeling that I just really can, whatever it is that I want to do, I can go forward. I mean, oh my gosh, your people. So I know that we have everybody talks about, you know, your crew, your tribe, all of the things, we also say that all of this is an inside job, right? You know, you should feel good from the inside out. I don't know about you, but some of the times that I have been the most spurred to action. And I think this really kind of answers a little bit about what you're asking. So there is this, if you can stick with me on a visual, action is what is going to fuel our confidence, not the other way around, right? We think that, "oh, I want to be confident. And then I'll take this action." It's actually completely again with the reverse, like it's the reverse. It's similar to like, if you're looking for motivation, we'll just do the thing that you're looking for motivation for and then the motivation will come. Confidence is very similar. So the quicker that you can take a really small step, which is core to feeling on last right is what is that small thing that I can do right now instead of waiting, waiting to figure out the big picture, waiting to figure out the path and then confidence will come in. What's really cool about that is that confidence is going to spur a bigger step, and then more confidence, and then a bigger step, and then more confidence. And then before you know it, you are actually creating all of the things that you were at one point, too lost, too scared, too not believing in yourself to do. And it really does come from those micro actions. Now, when I think about the micro actions, and this is kind of where I started this answer, and then I'm circling back when you think about those micro actions, and you think about confidence needed to do that, you know, we do always say like, oh, whatever is an inside job, like any of these feelings, oh that's an inside job. Well, actually, contrary to most of what people say, we do need external validation in order to do some of this, you just need the right external validation, the proper external validation. And I'll define what that means. That means people who are your biggest cheerleaders, really listening to them. In my own career, and in my own story, you know, there was a time when I was on the cusp of doing a lot of this, you know, launching my own business, and really, you know, kind of putting myself out there. And starting on this journey that I knew was true for me, it had been a seed inside me for quite some time. But I was scared. I didn't believe in my abilities to do it. And I actually surveyed 20 of my biggest fans. And when I say biggest fans, I mean, my dad. My best friends. Some mentors and sages, and ask them, you know, a series of questions. And in that, it still makes me cry to look at the state, because they literally predicted my life right now. And it's the coolest thing because it gave me all of the energy in the world. I was like, gosh, if they see this, then how can I step up to that level of belief in myself to match it? And it was just that little kick in the butt like, "okay, they believe it. I can believe it now, too." And then it's just doing something impossibly small, like one of my favorite questions to ask anytime I'm tapping into the energy, but I'm not really sure where it's all going, and I'm not really sure what I want is figuring out, I just asked myself this all the time, I probably asked myself yesterday. What is the absolute smallest thing that I can do right now, to do something about this energy, this good energy? And all kinds of things come up like a writing class or making that phone call or reaching out to somebody on Twitter. And it's all of our careers, the ones that we look up to, the ones that we idealize on Instagram, these people, well, first of all, it's not the whole story. But second of all, it was just a product of small step after small step after small step that built some real momentum. And also people that just kept going, like, Scott, what number episode are you on right now? What episode number is this?

Scott Anthony Barlow 12:55
This is... what number episode is this? No, like, we record them in advance. So yeah, you know, well over 200, right. 247. This is 247.

Maxie McCoy 13:05
247.

Scott Anthony Barlow 13:07
It sounds like a lot.

Maxie McCoy 13:09
It is. But that's the point, right? Like you just kept going, I'm sure you've got this all the time, especially now with podcasts blowing up. And you're like, hey, I've been doing this way before podcasts were trendy. And it's like, you did something, you kept going, you're still going and now you have one of the top career podcasts out there. Like that's how that stuff gets done. Not because you set out to know exactly what this was going to be X amount of years later.

Scott Anthony Barlow 13:35
Let me ask you about that exact thing. First of all, thank you. And second of all, thanks for being a part of that, too. Now, two of those... 247 episodes. But then you said something that I wanted to ask you about. You referenced it in the book. But I think it's so important. And I wanted to understand a bit more about your philosophy on this. You had mentioned, just a moment ago about, I didn't know where it was going entirely. And that's quite honest. And honestly, if you did ask me way back when, I would have told you something completely different than where I think it's going now. And it has gone a different direction. But also in your book, you reference, this concept of not having to know exactly what the destination is, and being able to, and you talked pretty extensively about this not having it all figured out. And then not always knowing that destination. So first of all, what do you mean by that? And how is that relevant to this concept of being lost?

Maxie McCoy 14:32
Yeah, so I think it's relevant and kind of what I was saying about we put all of this pressure on ourselves to have the big picture completely figured out. We tell ourselves, "Until I know where I'm going. I'm not going to begin" right. So unless I know how this pays out, how this plays out, how this gets me X, Y and Z exactly the 10 step plan to all the goals, right? There's so much pressure on goal setting and knowing your 5, 10, 20 year plan, then if I don't know that, I can't do anything about it, right? Like, I'm not going to do anything right now. What I mean by not knowing your destination is being willing to move the big picture aside, being willing to step into a place where you don't have to know where it all ends, in order to begin. And that's a way easier said than done. Right. But it is the difference between destination and direction. And so direction is what were the answer to your question is, "what direction is about?" It's about knowing what energizes you, knowing what deeply lights you up, which I believe, while we may not have the answer to where we want to go, while we may not have the answer to direction, right this second, if you are feeling impossibly lost, trust me, I've been there, it's a gnarly feeling. And anyone who tells you, it's all gonna be fine, or you're exactly where you're supposed to be like, I'm with you. I'm not violent, but would like to punch him in the mouth, I don't want to hear that. I don't want to be here. However, when you are able to tap into direction, all that is asking you to do is to look back on your life, and reflect, right, reflect on... where did I feel the most energized? Where did I feel the most proud? What actually puts this fire in my belly and lights me up? That, believe it or not, is your direction. That is what you should be following. If you can keep following that small step after small step after small step, you're going to get to a place where you're like, "Oh, I get where this all is going." But you make the path as you walk it, right. You don't have the path set out in front of you, which is the expectation that we have. So it's learning to move that expectation aside to take small step after small step, and to do that based on what deeply energizes you. I'll give you just an example from my own life. At the time when I felt the most lost, I had done an exercise just to kind of look back like where I don't know what I want anymore. Like none of this is working out, the big picture is not a big picture I want anymore. All these goals now feel empty. So when I look back, what do I care about? What energizes me? When did I feel the most proud? And everything Scott that kept coming back to me was, all about women's stories, women in their careers, writing, it was just these kind of like very clear picture moments. And so I did the smallest thing that I could do at the time, which is I signed up for a writing class here in San Francisco. I decided to write workshop in that class, a book proposal on women in their careers. And I mean, without getting into all the details, seven years later, here we are, because it launched me onto a pathway in so many serendipitous ways of doing exactly that. And it all came from a decision to reflect back, figure out what energizes me, figure out what I actually care about. And to do something small about that. That writing class, I didn't sign up for that writing class being like, "Oh, I'm going to be a speaker one day. I'm going to get paid to go to conferences and companies and have this book that I do all this press tours on." No, that was not part of it. I was just trying to do something, anything that energized me around the things that I cared about. And that is something that while you don't know the big picture, right, while you don't have to know the big picture, you do need to do some reflection on what deeply energizes you because that is your direction.

Scott Anthony Barlow 18:50
Why do you think that, I guess just from your personal experience, and what you've seen, why do you think that we all think that we do, in fact, have to know the big picture? I mean, I guess you mentioned the parts where we've got people left and right asking you for, "what's your five year plan? You don't have a 10 year plan?" But aside from that, like where do you think some of this comes from?

Maxie McCoy 19:15
Yeah, I mean, I think the pressure in general, right is we're all now living in a generation where this kind of middle pocket of transition from all the generations ahead of us, it was incredibly linear. People were at the majority, right? The majority of people were at companies for over many years. They had retirements, they had pensions, I don't even know what pension means anymore, right. Like...

Scott Anthony Barlow 19:41
Is that a thing?

Maxie McCoy 19:42
Yeah, no, but that's what I'm saying. Like, I literally, like I know this word, but I don't actually know what it means, because it hasn't been relevant to us, right. And now we have stepped into this zone and we are this generation of workers and where it's not just work and the path isn't linear anymore. And because that linear nature has burnt off, we're all trying to transition our mindset from, okay, all the generations before us. So therefore, culture around us has told us, you know, big picture, know where you're going, know what it is that you want, know the bright star, and everything is disrupting and changing. We could have one career in one place, and five years later, totally flip it up, and do something else completely. Cuz we can. And so I think so much of needing to know that big picture is A; a bit cultural, right, like it is ingrained in generations before us. And we're kind of trying to shimmy out of that mold. And then B; I mean, it's comfortable, right? Like, if I can go around telling people that like, yeah, one day, you know, I'm having a TV show, and I'm doing X, Y, and Z, that is really comfortable. But to tell someone like, I don't actually know what this all becomes two years from now. I mean, that is requiring a deep ability to step into the unknown. And the unknown is hard. I mean, I'm sure you have a million episodes on fear and the unknown, and all of the choices that we have to make in order to do that. But the lost is the unknown, like, you won't always be lost. But you will always be figuring out where you're going. And that is important, right? Because all of this is nonlinear. Our lives now are nonlinear. So I think it really does, the obsession with the big picture comes from, I want something that's known and certain. And I think it's a lot of cultural history.

Scott Anthony Barlow 21:47
But let me ask you this, then, if I'm in the place, and many of our listeners are, where I have been on the track, where I have sort of accepted what's in front of me, and I've gotten multiple promotions, or had other opportunities put in front of me, and then now I've realized that I don't want to do that anymore, necessarily, but I don't know what it is that I do want to be doing. Now that I've decided I don't want what people are just putting in front of me and accepting the next thing, and I want to take contro, but I don't know what that is.

Maxie McCoy 22:21
Yeah. What do you do?

Scott Anthony Barlow 22:23
What do you do, Maxie?

Maxie McCoy 22:24
First of all you know, I'm sure there's a lot of people listening that feel some version of that. I know, I felt it. Scott, you've probably felt it. And I think a big part of what happens when you're feeling that, when you're in something that you know you don't want to be in, but you don't know where it is you want to be and you're like "Ugh I'm so lost." Cuz that's where it comes up. First and foremost, please, whatever you do, don't take a huge leap. I think that the big leap is BS, I think we have really glamorize like, "Okay, if I don't like this, I'm just gonna quit my job and travel the world and figure it out or start this business." And that's great if that's what you've been working on. But if you haven't been working on that the big leap is total BS. The big leap is actually when you leave that job and you do go do whatever it is that you want to do is a small step after small step after small step that got to an inflection point where you were actually able to do that. So if you're sitting in that place, I think one of the things that we have completely forgotten about, because we expect everything we do to make us money, like the side hustle galore is the power of small plans, the power of projects, right? To get a sense of what is it that is kind of exciting to me, like what is it that, you know, I want to sort of dabble in? I already referenced like looking back and reflecting I think that's a really important first piece, and then figuring out what is the absolute smallest thing I could do about this excitement and energy? And then figuring out, what is a small project or a small plan that I can put into place? That I can do to start to test out how I feel in this, right, because you don't want to change industries or change careers completely and then feel the exact same thing all over again. I have done that before, by the way. I made a really big shift from immediately, from sports broadcasting to nonprofit but still related to sports. But thinking that I was going to get more into like a corporate responsibility, like track to feel lost twice in a row from making a really big switch based in nothing, it's not a good way. So what you can do is you can figure out what are the small projects or plans that I can put in place. And let me tell you, when you were putting your energy there, it helps you when you're in a job that you don't like because you are putting the energy somewhere else to kind of, to test and try and validate those feelings and not energy and then put a plan into place for a big quote unquote bigger leap or a bigger change.

Scott Anthony Barlow 25:09
Okay, so and actually something that might be really both validating and relevant here is, for those people that have in the past made those really big leaps in one way or another, I've dropped everything and gone and traveled the world.

Maxie McCoy 25:25
Congratulations.

Scott Anthony Barlow 25:26
Yeah, congratulations. And occasionally, I get an email from people who said, "Hey, this was the best thing I've ever done." But for every one of those emails, I probably get between 10 and 20. Let's say, "Hey, I did this in the first three months were awesome. And then I started to feel the pressure of what I'm going to do now that I got back in then it totally changes things. And now I'm back. And I still don't know... I'm not any better of where I want to go and what to do. And I'm still like that. I'm right back where I started."

Maxie McCoy 25:56
Can I give you a super small anecdote right now because it's so universe and funny. My best friend has been, did this exactly quit her job as traveling for what has been three plus months. She's literally in my living room right now. I woke up to her in my living room reading my book, because she was like, "I thought it was all gonna feel different when I came back, and it doesn't. And I now need to figure this out." And so I'm just laughing because you gave the exact anecdote as my best friend in my living room right now.

Scott Anthony Barlow 26:24
Oh my... well, it's good thing you wrote a book that can help her out.

Maxie McCoy 26:28
That's what she said, she goes, "Did you write this for me? Because we're already such good friends, you didn't need to do this for me."

Scott Anthony Barlow 26:34
That is hilarious. But it's true, though. Because I really think that when you do that, just to give a little bit further validation here, when you do that, it's sort of putting a bandaid fix on it in some ways. And I think a lot of times, we believe, I've done this too, that if we just take this leap like that is going to... the rest is going to just happen. And that's going to give us the insights or it's going to allow the clarity, like something magical is going to happen. And it will be fun. And there's probably many things that can happen. That's good from the experience. However, we've got a lot of research and a lot just practical evidence, and everything that you just pointed out to leads us to believe that you can do it a better way in a more efficient way too. So unless there's another reason to take a huge leap, and you've done some of these other things, you've already tested it. Because you said "Hey, what's the absolute smallest thing I can do? What's a project that I can do to test this out?" If I've done a few of those things, and that indicates to me that I should take this bigger leap, I think you're in a different situation than just doing.

Maxie McCoy 27:34
Yeah. And I think is really important for all of us to remember is that, you know, when you do those small plans, and when you do those small projects, you have no idea where it's all going to lead you, you have no clue who you might meet, where it might lead, the position it might put you in. And that's why you just have to take the step no matter what, because trust me, the universe and the world has way bigger stuff in store for you, provided you get into action. You can't just be the kid on the side of the pool, thinking about how to jump in, you have to actually jump in. But that jump can be small. And those small things can have incredible returns, provided you keep taking small step up or small step.

Scott Anthony Barlow 28:19
It doesn't have to be a cannonball.

Maxie McCoy 28:21
No. Exactly, or a swan dive or a belly flop. And it won't be a belly flop. But I think that's kind of the big thing that we all worry about when we do... it's like oh, but I don't know if this idea is a good idea. I don't know if it'll pan out. I don't know if it'll X, Y and Z because we expect it to have this amazing result. Or we're scared of failing either way, and neither will be true, you're not probably gonna have an amazing, you know, result and like figure your life out in a single step. But you're also not going to fail, you're just not going to. And I think that failure piece is important to talk about because when we get scared about the steps, we often are scared because you know, we're feeling the pressure of perfection, we're feeling the pressure of this being the answer to figuring it all out. For me, and I'm sure you've done this in your own life, anytime you get to those inflection points, and you're really having a hard time taking the step forward, I just always go back, you know, I was having to do this this week because of some stuff that is, you know, really pushing me to my own expansion edge of like, what is the worst case scenario? What is the absolute worst thing that could happen here? And if it happens, what is my plan B? And I'm telling you, if you can look at those answers and still be excited and energized by what it is that you're thinking about, and you know that you can handle that because fear, as we know gets brighter and gets more intense in the dark. But when you put out your worst case scenario, bring it to the light and you can handle it like you just can when you see that and then you write your own plan B.

Scott Anthony Barlow 29:57
The plan B, I love that for so many reasons. I was toiling through all kinds of different things in my head. So let me ask you for a second step back to something else that you mentioned earlier. And that piece of external validation. And you mentioned it in the context of, "Hey, I reached out to 20 of my biggest fans, and they told me all the things that are absolutely awesome." And actually, I would totally recommend that people do that, that's actually something that we do in some of our coaching programs, we'll have people reach out and be able to solicit questions about what are some of their biggest strengths. And you know, we give people a script and everything like that, and people will take so many learnings, it's so empowering.

Maxie McCoy 30:37
Oh my god, it is one of the... can I... I just want to step in. No matter what version of it you do, that 360 degree reflection with the people that love and see you, I think is, if there is one thing you take this conversation, just go do that. Like if you are in any place of feeling lost, just go do that in any kind of format. Like, it'll give you insight that I truly believe will be life changing.

Scott Anthony Barlow 31:00
Absolutely, as we've got the data to prove it, but...

Maxie McCoy 31:03
Yeah, exactly.

Scott Anthony Barlow 31:04
Yeah. But what about when it gets further along? Let's say that you've already done that, you've already done some of these small projects, what types of validation could I be looking for to know that I'm seeing the right road signs that I should continue heading this direction versus turning around?

Maxie McCoy 31:21
Oh, that is such a good question. But to be honest, I have never thought about before. I really think that when we're talking about the validation that you should keep going, there is going to be both the internal and the external validation, right? Because there's plenty of times we are on paths that everyone else is like, "Oh, that's amazing" or "Oh, you're so good at this." But it doesn't resonate with our soul. Like that was me in sports broadcasting. I was good at being on camera and covering sports. But there was something in me that was saying "This isn't it" you know, those loud whispers of gut instinct you absolutely have to listen to. But I think when you're talking about being far enough along on the path that you've pretty much found some direction, right? Because you've been taking some small steps, you've been doing some projects, I think the validation comes in A; how you feel, and B; people's response to it that you care about. But I think that, at that point in the journey, it doesn't really matter. Like this point, in my journey, there's plenty of people who still do not understand how or what I do. And I don't care, right, because I am so deeply anchored in the value that I'm able to provide and where my skill set is matching my intention for this world to really deeply help the global rise of women is my very macro goal. And I've been able now to figure out how the skills and talents layer on to that, that has taken a lot of work and a lot of years. And that's, I still have days where I feel lost, right. But I think at the place in the path that you're talking about, it really is internal validation at that point, because you have been testing, you have been trying, you know how you feel if you are getting kind of feedback and signals from the world, people are purchasing things from you, they're wanting to hire you. They are connecting and resonating with what it is that you're saying. Those are all little blinking signs to just keep going. But I've actually been asking you that, Scott, I feel like you would have a really good answer to that question.

Scott Anthony Barlow 33:28
You know, I was thinking about that. And I'm asking it, because it's on my mind. It's something I get asked clearly. And usually we have like a formula and a system for nearly everything. And I realized that we don't necessarily have that too. So...

Maxie McCoy 33:41
Yeah. And I'm not sure you can. I don't know.

Scott Anthony Barlow 33:44
I think that to your point, though, something that I've learned and been really horrific at during the early years, it's taken me a long time to start paying attention to this, those whispers that you're talking about, you know, from your gut, from your heart and being able to actually pay attention to those, I think for many years, I probably spent about, geez after I got out of high school and everything like that probably spent a good 10 years, instead of listening to them, justifying them away. And instead saying, "Well, really, this would be better because of blah, blah, blah" even though it didn't feel right.

Maxie McCoy 34:19
I know, oh my god, it's so true. And I think it really does. And that's it. Like that in its core is it like when you are feeling that gut and that whisper we do all kinds of things. We ignore it away, we justify it away, we quiet it, we do all of this stuff. And what's sad is like the whispers will go away and then you'll just feel a whole lot of nothing. And the lack of enthusiasm, the lack of inspiration, the lack of all of those things is Oh, that's like not life. So the more that you can honor those little whispers not by thinking that you have to go change your life in an instant because you heard something, but just that you can honor it in some tiny way, is going to get you on the path to direction.

Scott Anthony Barlow 35:03
I think that's it. I think that is it. I think it becomes a much like anything else, it becomes something that is practiced. I think, conventionally I've seen that, not all, but many women are better at listening to those feelings than many men I've encountered, including myself. So I think if...

Maxie McCoy 35:21
We're programmed to some serious mama instinct. But you know, it's a version of that instinct, whether you ever become a mom or not.

Scott Anthony Barlow 35:28
Yeah, absolutely. But I think it's still no matter what, it becomes something that you have to practice, much like anything else, it becomes almost a skill, for lack of a better phrase in order to really pay attention to that in a way that is giving you those indicators. I think that is it. I wish there were an easier way.

Maxie McCoy 35:47
Well, I think one of my favorite things with that instinct that I've gotten to your point it becoming a practice is back to the idea of reflecting back before you move forward. Look back on all the times that you've ignored a gut instinct, and how did that turn out? And then all the times you've sort of listened to it or maybe you've never listened to it before, and how did that turn out? And trust me, when you listen, it always turns out really nicely, eventually, right? And so it just you learn and you practice how to honor it in some small way.

Scott Anthony Barlow 36:19
I think that we should have got one more question. But I think we should end on that. I think that internal validation piece is what I'm really talking about here. After you've done that work, after you have validated externally, being able to listen, in order to keep going is going to really, then you don't need roadsigns at this point, I guess now that I'm thinking it out, here's my tendency to go back to logic, right? So let me ask you this, then, if as you have gone through some, well, you've gone through a variety of different times where you have had these feelings of being lost. And what would you say is the one or two biggest things that you have learned from that that you want to pass on?

Maxie McCoy 37:07
First. No, I know, I'm like, you can hear the like big, like, what are the biggest things? First and foremost, being lost is not a bad thing. Contrary to anyone feeling the opposite right now, it is a scary feeling. It is a uncomfortable feeling. But let me tell you it is in forming so much more than you can possibly imagine right now. They're in feeling lost is an answer to where you've been, it's an answer to where you never want to go again. And so if you weren't here, you wouldn't be getting to where you're eventually going to be. So first and foremost, just know that sitting in this, we're gonna bleep this out, but like sitting in the ship, and really, instead of trying to immediately shake off the discomfort and immediately get out of this feeling of being lost, know that there's some lessons, there's a lot of lessons to be learned here in forcing you to go back and figure out, what is it that I'm learning by being here? What is it that I never want to do again? What is it that is energizing and inspiring me forward? And so if you had never felt lost, you would never be forced to do and to examine so much of this. That's the first thing that it really is giving us all kinds of lessons. And I think the second thing that I've learned from feeling lost really is that you are actually never going to have it figured out. And the more that you can tap into yourself, tap into all the things that make you amazing and wonderful and tech and the things that you're good at, the more that you can really, really route into that power, the more that nothing is going to stop you. You'll be able to figure out any challenge, any feeling of being lost, because you're willing to do something in the face of that. And that something is the small actions that build your confidence. And that'll take you through your entire life. So the quicker that you can come back to yourself and come back to your own power as the answer to take a small step, the better off you're going to be forever. So it's a skill set that lost is teaching you but that will spur you forward for the many, many chapters of our lives.

Scott Anthony Barlow 39:32
That is amazing. And I really appreciate you making the time to come on the show again, Maxie. And oh my goodness, I'm just excited every time we get to chat, quite honestly.

Maxie McCoy 39:43
Me too. And thank you for having me.

Scott Anthony Barlow 39:44
Absolutely. Go check out the book. The book is "Lost". Where is it available? Tell people where they can actually get their hands on this thing.

Maxie McCoy 39:52
You can get "You're Not Lost" and inspired action plan for finding your own way on Amazon. Go grab it on Amazon. You'll see it there. When you type in my name or you type in "You're Not Lost", it'll be right there for you. And it has a lot of actions, a lot of worksheets, a lot of stories more of my story. So it's something that you can really like get your hands on, and have a lot of fun with.

Scott Anthony Barlow 40:15
Hey, by the way, if you're feeling lost, if you're feeling alike you want to move down a pathway that makes sense for you, and you want to really begin to do the work to understand what that is, you can actually go over to figureitout.co, that's figureitout.co. And you can join our eight day mini course that we've put together to help you get moving down that path. And really identifying what you want to be doing and where you want to be spending your time and your career so that you no longer feel lost. You can get going right now, right this second. It's one tiny step, just like Maxie had talked about to move you down the path to get where you want to go. Head on over there right now to figureitout.co. Or we can actually even text, yeah, just like send us a text. And we'll sign you up pretty much. You can text, HAPPEN to 44222. It's that easy. We'll see you over there. But we have so much more in store for you next week, right here on Happen To Your Career. Next week, we dig into a way that most people don't think about when they are really interested in doing their own thing. And running their own business is something that I have personal experience with. And it's a lot of times and an overlooked option as a great way to develop a first business.

Dru Carpenito 41:46
And so you know, it's not for everybody, but for those that go on to be the happy and successful business owners and franchise owners that I've worked with. The easiest way for me to describe it is they end up crossing this chasm mentally, they just kind of have this thought that I'm not happy in what I'm doing. And I feel like there could be more opportunity for me, but for whatever reason, you know, I'm not finding into the corporate world.

Scott Anthony Barlow 42:14
That's Dru Carpenito. And we invited him on specifically to talk about an alternative that most people don't think of when they're thinking of doing their own thing and getting into business for themselves. And that's franchises. But not the type of franchises that most people think of with, I don't know, burgers and fries or things like that, no, instead franchises in how they can specifically align with a life and career that you want to build. That's what we wanted to talk to Dru about because that's actually, as weird as it sounds, what he does for a living. All right, all that and so much more next week right here on Happen To Your Career. We'll see then. Until then. I'm out. Adios.