123: Small Steps to Big Results

Introduction 00:01
This is the Happen To Your Career podcast, Episode 123.

Mark Sinclair 00:06
I thought, if I'm gonna do this, I can't say I've tried everything until I've gone out there and actually met with these people because the response I was getting back from recruitment consultants was, can you come and say this, my initial thoughts on the father then, after sitting back and thinking, I'm like, "why not."

Scott Anthony Barlow 00:26
Hey HTYCers, if you've been struggling to figure out work that fits you then join our eight day free mini course, all you have to do is text HTYC to 38470. That's HTYC to 38470 or simply visit, figureitout.co that's figureitout.co I'll see you there.

Introduction 00:57
This is Happen To Your Career, we help you stop doing work that doesn't fit you, figure out what does and then make it happen. Whether you're looking to do your own thing, or find your dream job, you've come to the right place. I'm Scott Barlow.

Scott Anthony Barlow 01:16
This is Scott Anthony Barlow. You are listening to Happen To Your Career. This is the show that helps you figure out what work fits you by exploring other people's stories and other people's career paths. We get to bring on lots of different experts and also people that have pretty amazing stories like Dr. Lynn Marie Morskie, who believe it or not, quit her way to her dream career. And you can go back and listen to her episode, and many others in the archives on Happen To Your Career, you can go to iTunes and Stitcher and wherever else you get your podcast episodes. But today is a special day because we're not only going to talk to somebody who is just like you, where they've gone from where they are to what they really want to be doing. No, we're actually going to talk to a listener of the show, who we ended up doing some work with... he went through one of our programs called figure out what fits. And since then, he's had, I think, pretty short and phenomenal journey. And he's different than most of the people that we bring on, because usually we'll bring on people that have fully made the career change, but he's actually in the midst of it, and still even exploring, you could say. So he's actually rapidly pursuing photography as a career. And that's drastically different from what he's done in the past. It's also something that clearly he loves, you can hear it as he's talking about it, but you're gonna get to hear our conversation in which we talk about not only how he's gone down this path, but how he went from what he was doing, to being able to which was dreaming and always thinking about stuff to actually live in much more intentionally, and exactly how he did that. Plus, you're going to get to hear how he was restricted by all kinds of different mental barriers, didn't really think that work that he loved was even a possibility to completely flipping the switch doing a 180 and saying, "look, I can do this" and then taking the steps to actually move down the road to make it happen in a very short period of time. He has been able to go from not thinking about this at all, to deciding that photography is something that he wants to pursue and he wants to explore to actually getting his first photography opportunity. So that is pretty cool. And you're going to get to hear all that in quite a bit more in my conversation with Mark Sinclair. All right, here we go.

Scott Anthony Barlow 03:56
I'm really interested in your story because partially because... partially I know a little bit about it, I know what's happened since you found Happen To Your Career, and we started working with you a little bit and, you know, you got into our program but I don't know anything about your past long before that. So I'm super curious, you know, where this journey started for you. And where you started working in the first place and what type of work you were doing when you first got into the workforce?

Mark Sinclair 04:36
Okay, so we're going back.

Scott Anthony Barlow 04:38
We're going way back, way back Mark.

Mark Sinclair 04:41
Way over 20 years ago, I'm actually was born/raised in England. So I've only been in Australia the last six years. So after school like on a whim for a door and a few different jobs, I never really had much have an idea what I wanted to do, charged staff by process of elimination. So, started off working as a fruit and vegetable stacker in a supermarket. I've moved on and on the picture framing. I've been a fork truck driver. I've been a waiter, a bar man, a bar manager. And I guess that was the point in my early 20s when I decided, "Okay, I think I want to try something different." And that's where my life took a big change, of course, oh actually went to Australia backpacking for year. That really started my love affair with the country. I stayed for a year different peaking and kind of worked my way up and down the coast. And then ended up back in England, 23 years old, no job thinking, "Right. What's next?" So at that point, I've been a full truck driving for a year to get back into the workforce. And then I ended up doing a cable course for data cabling, moved down to London, on two weeks work experience and stayed for seven years.

Scott Anthony Barlow 06:16
I had no idea you done so many different types of things of all varieties.

Mark Sinclair 06:22
I'll find a consistent theme of not really knowing, I've tried a lot of stuff and gradually working my way to that actually what I want to say.

Scott Anthony Barlow 06:33
That's super interesting then. You ended up going over to Australia, spending a year and everything along those lines. And then you obviously you know, I'm gonna say came back to Australia with your love of the country. But I'm curious, what do you think was causing you to go from job to job or career to career? Was it really just trying to figure out what made sense for you? Or was it just opportunities at the time or something totally different? Because you've done a lot of stuff, Mark.

Mark Sinclair 07:15
Yeah, we're not writing it down. And actually, yeah, I've never really looked at it all on one big picture before. But yeah, I kind of noticed that after a couple of years, I tend to move on or get bored or try to want to do something else. But since I've gone into the communications industry in 1999, I've stayed stable employed in that industry. So after my seven years in London, I joined another company in England, and after a couple of years, I was thinking, I need to do something different again. And that's when my real urge to make effort to move to Australia kicked in. So that was back in 2000. And I had friends over here I started, I was coming over on holiday once a year and then 2009 I got serious, say, I was spending my evenings hitting up recruitment consultants, cold calling them trying to find out if I could gain views over the phone or wasn't really getting me anywhere and in depth for eight months. So for right, last round of dice, I'm gonna go on holiday, packed my suit and try grab some interviews all on there. And it worked. My last diamond to wait til holiday, met more now boss, and he gave me a job.

Scott Anthony Barlow 08:40
That's interesting, cuz I get questions all the time from people who are like, "Hey, I want to... I live over here, I want to work in this other area, whether it's another state in the United States, or whether it's another country or whether you know, whatever it happens to be." But I think that's a big, perceived challenge for people. And it sounds like, initially you were going through where you're like, "Hey, I'm gonna try and send out resumes or, you know, contact these people from England." But then eventually, you just said, "Look, I'm going down there, and I'm going to make this happen." What prompted you to do that? Was just the lack of success in the first way that you were trying it? Or was there other stuff that caused you to say, "Look, I'm gonna do down down there." Who you are already going down there anyway?

Mark Sinclair 09:35
I'm gonna probably go on holidays anyway. But I thought if I'm gonna do this, I can't say I've tried everything until I've gone out there and actually met with these people because the response I was getting back from recruitment consultants was, "Can you come and see us?" My initial thought, Oh, that's a bit far. But then, after sitting back and thinking I'm like, "why not?" At least then I can satisfy myself that if I go out there, try my best, and still don't get any luck, I can satisfy my mind. I've tried this time. So maybe try something else another option but it proved to be, once I've got in front of consultants, and they'd say, "No" I'd made the effort to go there. They're way more inclined to meet with you, when you just ring them up and say, "Oh, look, I'm going to be over for a couple of weeks. Let's grab a coffee." So I found that very much more receptive.

Scott Anthony Barlow 10:30
Interesting, but I think a lot of people are afraid to do that. And I know it's been a few years ago for you. But that's been my experience that, that works a lot of the time, because it almost gives that context to be able to, or almost excuse for lack of a better phrase, even though I think that's the wrong one, to meet up with people, "Hey, I'm gonna be in town. I'd be interested in working with your company or learning more about it or whatever else." But then virtually nobody I know actually does that. So one kudos to you for actually doing it. Clearly, it panned out for you. And two, was that difficult for you? Or was it... it just seemed like the natural thing to do at the time?

Mark Sinclair 11:28
I guess it felt quite difficult at the time, but I'm the type of person that if I'm going to go for something, I'm going to go for it. And I won't be happy with myself if there's something I could have tried and didn't. So near my head wants to go this idea, and I got a bit of feedback from one of the consultants that would be prepared to meet review if he come, I don't know, well, okay, if he says that, I'm going to get a list of other people, send them emails, and I got responses back from pretty much all of them saying, "Yeah, if you're here, come meet me." So that was enough impetus to get me going.

Scott Anthony Barlow 12:07
Sometimes that's all it takes, right? Just a little bit to get the ball rolling, and then you can jump in. So what happened from there then? Since you've been in Australia, have you been in the same type of role? Or how has that panned out for you? And what type of work are you doing right now?

Mark Sinclair 12:27
My day job, I'm a technical support engineer for a communications company. So I mean, the same job that I was doing or got employed to do back from my interview in 2009. So I've been doing that ever since really, the industry you forever learning new stuff, but I just find it, I don't have a passion for anymore. Which is both prompted my way of thinking at the moment around pursuing photography.

Scott Anthony Barlow 12:58
That's interesting. I so badly want to ask you all about that. But first, I'm curious what ended up happening, that you started realizing, "hey, look, I don't have a long term passion for this. Even though I get to learn a lot, even though it can be challenging in some cases, and in good ways." Like, where did you start to realize that "hey, this is probably not for me, or long term."

Mark Sinclair 13:28
Okay, well, last year, I turned 40, let's call it a midlife crisis. I'm calling it midlife reawakening. And I started thinking, well, do I see myself doing this in 10 years time? Do I see myself doing this in 15 years time? And then till I'm 65? And I answered 'no' to all of them. So got me thinking and started listening to podcasts, used being among one of them and got my mind thinking along different lines to what I thought about before just saw a steady job, buying the mortgage. Everything's good. And I've never really opened myself up to the possibilities of other opportunities that I could go after. And it's just started from there.

Scott Anthony Barlow 14:17
That's interesting. What kind of resources have you found along the way? Because I think, you know, you're a listener to our show, and now not so ironically, you're on the show, which is awesome. But I'm curious what else has kind of helped you expand that mindset and expand those possibilities for yourself, because so many of our listeners are in that same place where they haven't necessarily had the exposure to thinking about it in that new and different way where it's like, "Hey, I can not only do work, but I can do something that adds value to the world that I really actually enjoy too at the same time." But I'm curious, besides this show, what else has helped you?

Mark Sinclair 15:09
Okay, well, only says, became photographer, listen to the improved photography podcast with more hive of knowledge or listen to the side hustle.

Scott Anthony Barlow 15:21
Nick Loper.

Mark Sinclair 15:22
Yeah.

Scott Anthony Barlow 15:23
Yeah, he's been on our show.

Mark Sinclair 15:26
Yeah, I heard him on there and Michael Hyatt as well. And then just getting resources, wherever you can find them, or looking on the internet. We have a skills of library of work that we can use as well. So just getting information from everywhere, really. And then once I found your site, he kind of put everything together.

Scott Anthony Barlow 15:52
That is awesome. So what then caused you to actually start taking action on this? Because now you're pursuing photography. Like, let's cut to the end. And spoiler alert, like you're fastly moving towards the photography world. And you just had a pretty cool moment the other day, because you got your first, I guess, photography opportunity is probably the easiest way to say it, and coolest way to say it. So congratulations, first of all, because it wasn't that long ago, where like, you were just sort of thinking about photography, right? Is that fair to say?

Mark Sinclair 16:38
Yes. Yeah, certainly as a possible career. Awful side business. Yes.

Scott Anthony Barlow 16:43
So that's awesome. And kudos go out to you for actually doing something to be able to make it happen. But what took place for you to be able to actually go from "Hey, I know that this, what I'm doing right now, is paying the bills. But it's not really getting me where I want to be long term and I don't want to be doing this for the next 15 years, or 20 years or whatever else, to actually exploring other opportunities and making the decision for photography." And then now going and getting your first photography opportunity.

Mark Sinclair 17:22
Guess the biggest thing with me is actually believing, "no, I could do it." Again, through my own mental barriers. Just believe in the, "I would be good enough or could be good enough." Because all the doubting voices in my head are gone, "oh you don't have the knowledge, you can't do this." And maybe you should get it better before you start trying to get opportunities and all these sort of questions going around in my head. And now I've got my head around there. I can say that well, everyone had to start somewhere. So no professional photographer was professional the day they first started or got their first opportunity.

Scott Anthony Barlow 18:06
Yeah.

Mark Sinclair 18:06
To get professional, you get experience, they start getting some experience.

Scott Anthony Barlow 18:12
That's so right. But I think everybody gets caught up with that same thing that you just said is, "hey, look, you know, I'm not good enough. I don't have the skills yet." And all these other things that have a tendency to run through our head. But was there anything that happened that caused you to think about that differently? Because you went from all of these different mental barriers, which I really do think everybody goes through in some fashion, like everybody gets caught up in their own head and says, "Look, this is not going to be possibility for me" or "I might not be able to do this" to on the other side of that, where you're like, "Hey, I could actually do this."

Mark Sinclair 18:53
Well, for our break into kind of small action steps. So what if I'm going to do this, let's try not think about the big end game, let's think of what's the first thing I can do that will move me closer to it. That way, it doesn't seem as daunting. And that first little step to me was join the local camera club, that turned out to be the place where they were looking for volunteers, which lined me up with my first opportunity now. So put yourself in a place where the opportunities are more likely to come, surround yourself with people in the same interest that you learn from them. That was my first point of call.

Scott Anthony Barlow 19:37
That's fantastic. That's absolutely fantastic. So how long ago was that?

Mark Sinclair 19:42
January. Ah no, first week of February.

Scott Anthony Barlow 19:46
Really? So we're talking... we just got in... or we're in April now. Just a couple of months ago.

Mark Sinclair 19:54
Yes.

Scott Anthony Barlow 19:54
That's amazing. So, okay, I didn't realize it was that soon. That's very very cool. So then what's step number two for you, as you experienced it?

Mark Sinclair 20:06
Step number two is my ongoing, one on the one I enjoy the most going out taking photos, finding experience, improving my skills. So, oh, I'm lucky I live in a beautiful part of the world. So I'm out there on weekends when I can take in sunset shots and love taking photos, and the kids they were five take on experimental models. Depending on their mood, they're either photographic gold or not.

Scott Anthony Barlow 20:39
Yeah, we have some of that around too. I'm not the world's best photographer by a longshot. But I love being an amateur photographer. And I totally know what you mean. Like, with our three little kids, it's they're either on or they're not. Sometimes there's not in between.

Mark Sinclair 21:01
Keep samples there.

Scott Anthony Barlow 21:02
Yeah, totally. So step number one for you, actually almost there's like a pre step a little bit, because you had to make the decision first, that, "Hey, look, photography is at this is something I want to explore. This is something I actually think that there's a possibility behind." And then once you made that decision, it really sounded like it was, how do I expose myself to other people that are doing this? And that's where you join that club. Right? And then from there, it's okay, now that, now I'm starting to expose myself to this area and this thing that I'm interested in, you know, how do I actually get some experience in it? And that for you is the taking of the photos and actually going and doing the craft itself. And after that, what led you up to this first opportunity to kind of build your portfolio in a more professional manner?

Mark Sinclair 21:56
Okay, so we're looking for volunteers. Club, there's a local charity, which is another thing I wanted to get involved in trying to help people, as well. They're looking for people to just capture the... they're doing a comic book convention.

Scott Anthony Barlow 22:14
Cool.

Mark Sinclair 22:15
And so they want someone to capture it for Instagram, and I'm big on social media. So that's right up my strength. It's gonna be a lot of fun and opportunity to just take pictures and then kind of make a diary of the day for them, applied to their soil afterwards. It's exciting, something completely different for me. So I'm really looking forward to it.

Scott Anthony Barlow 22:42
That is fantastic, especially since it's both helping people and in the comic book sector. I love it.

Scott Anthony Barlow 22:49
Let me cut back in here for a second, I want you to meet Tracy.

Tracy 22:53
I'm Tracy and I'm from San Diego. I am a microbiology lab supervisor at a medical device diagnostics company here in town.

Scott Anthony Barlow 23:00
Before Tracy found our eight-day figured out course, here's what life was like for her.

Tracy 23:05
I was drowning in debt, and seriously struggling to find a way out of it. I've got student loans from the late 90s that I'm trying to pay down as well as a car loan.

Scott Anthony Barlow 23:16
Okay, now you might be thinking, what does that have to do with Tracy's career? And what does any of this have to do with this eight-day figured out course.

Tracy 23:23
And this course really helped me to gain a lot of clarity around what was important to me, and helped me to see possibilities beyond my current situation. So with that, I've actually started a small virtual assistant business on the side, and I have been able to seriously accelerate my debt repayment plan, I will be a completely debt free in just over two years from now.

Scott Anthony Barlow 23:44
Wow. Congratulations, Tracy. We love hearing stories just like that one. Now, if you want that type of clarity, that can help you move forward in your life, here's what you can do, just text HTYC to 38470, HTYC to 38470 or just visit figureitout.co. That's figureitout.co.

Scott Anthony Barlow 24:09
I really love what you're doing because you are in the thick of it. And you are rapidly pursuing this goal that ties right in with what you really actually want to be doing over the long term. And, you know, that's probably where a lot of our listeners are in kind of that place. They're either trying to figure out what it is that they want to do, or they've identified it, and are just starting to move towards that. And I think it's so cool that you're in that that place of your journey and I'm super excited that we get to play and have been able to play even a tiny part of that in the first place. I'm curious, what was your experience like going through figure out what fits, because you spent, that's where we started to get to know each other a little bit. I think you came on and went through our eight-day mini course first, if I remember correctly, and then you got into figure out what fits. Is that right? Do I remember that correctly?

Mark Sinclair 25:17
Yes, that's right. That was back in January.

Scott Anthony Barlow 25:20
Yeah, back in January. So what was that experience like for you? And how did that tie in here?

Mark Sinclair 25:30
Okay, well, I think one of the cores actually gave to me I'd never done before was writing all this stuff down. I've never written down, like answering what your ideal day is, and visioning of who would be of a dream above, neither actually took the time to document anything or the small streams or write down what my fears are. And that, to me, was the single biggest gain actually seen in front of me. And I was going through with my wife and getting her opinions, and it just gave me a lot more clarity around what I wanted to do once I could see it written down.

Scott Anthony Barlow 26:11
That's interesting. So it was for you, it was the actual fact of getting it, you know, onto a document, onto paper or onto whatever it is that you used digital format, whatever it happens to be, but getting that out of your head and out of the dream stage, and then into something that's much more tangible and clear. Why was that such a big deal for you?

Mark Sinclair 26:39
That's something I've never done or thought of doing. I've always got a ton of ideas going around in my head. But a lot of them never really seemed to get me where I feel more writing them down, I can actually make sense of them prioritize. And I don't know why it's taken me 40 years to get to that point. But I am there now. So I have now start doing a lot more writing stuff down.

Scott Anthony Barlow 27:06
I don't think you should beat yourself up over it at all. I mean, most people go through their entire lives, like literally their entire lives, like never having done a lot of this stuff intentionally. And what's really interesting for me, and I think something that's really really powerful here, and I think you get... I just get man in my mind, you get a ton of credit for this being able to go from not doing that to now, a much more intentional type of living where geez, like, we're talking back in January, we're not talking like a couple of years or anything like that. But you've now gone through, really done the hard work of considering what you want life to be like. And now then you started writing into down, started living much more intentionally, and then boom, and now you're already getting opportunities that are going to pave the way for you to be able to really do what you actually want to. That's flippin amazing, Mark.

Mark Sinclair 28:07
Thank you.

Scott Anthony Barlow 28:08
Nicely done, sir.

Mark Sinclair 28:12
Certainly given life a new spark anyway.

Scott Anthony Barlow 28:15
Very cool. So what does your wife think about all this?

Mark Sinclair 28:20
She was a bit concerned at first, to say the least. I think her initial reaction is, you know, quitting the day job, we got more mortgage to pay and it was the pi. And after a while she kind of, she knows how much it means to me. So she's my biggest fan. But I've had to do a lot of reassuring. There's been some days where we have to reassure again, I have a tendency to sometimes get a little bit carried away in the moment. So she's more grandma.

Scott Anthony Barlow 28:52
That is... So Alyssa and I, went through a lot of the same thing over the years because I'm very much the dreamer or as I think it was Jon Acuff, have you ever heard of him, but he says, like, I'm the "wow" person. And in this case, Alyssa is the "how" person. So I'm like, I'm gonna start a business and we're gonna help people with their careers. And she's like, "how's it gonna pay the bills." And I think that just to your point, there really has to be a lot of, not just reassuring, but also really helping, I almost call it like, I had to help Alyssa get on board with what I was talking about and see the value in it and see why it was important to me and everything else. But I'm curious how you have done that because I think everybody who has a relationship, has a partner, has a spouse, whatever, they kind of go through that when somebody in the relationship is like hey, I'm really interested in making this big change in my career, so how have you kind of dealt with that and in helping reassure her?

Mark Sinclair 30:09
I just keep telling her that, look, I'm not quitting the day job, everything is gonna be fine. And, you know, I wouldn't do anything to jeopardize her. We're financially stable, and we want to stay that way. And I tell another photography is gonna be something that builds up gradually on the side, and then we'll see where it goes from there. I'm not saying like, in two years, I'm quitting my job, I'm gonna be a photographer, it's like, well, we'll build it up on the side, and let's see where we go with that, take it month to month, and that's helped her a lot. Now, I know, there's not gonna be a big, sharp transition, it's just gonna be small steps, nothing too much time just, you know, one job after the other, look at it like that.

Scott Anthony Barlow 30:54
I think that's the right way to look at it, though. I mean, geez, look, in a matter of a few months, all those small steps, like you're talking about, like, we just listed a few of them out, get started with getting everything down and being able to live on purpose. And, I mean, you did that through our program. But like, there's lots of different ways to be able to make that happen, ultimately, though, made the decision to get it on paper on purpose. And then, you know, from there, each of those tiny steps to be able to get those first couple opportunities. So small steps have been working for you, Mark.

Mark Sinclair 31:36
I had. I think, to build it up successfully, that's gonna continue to be my playing, just try and go one step ahead of the game and look to the next job. Now, how am I going to get it? What do I need to do to get it? Which is why I'm in the portfolio building stage at the moment, say, I don't or haven't said this is going to be my niche, I just want to build up on all sorts of photography, and prove my skills, and then when that will help me become more rounded, and there'll be more opportunities as well.

Scott Anthony Barlow 32:12
It's really funny the way that that kind of builds in and grows, like, it's almost like this tri-effect of, as you build out relationships around, you know, other people that are doing it, and as you start interacting with other people in that type of context and on top of that, expand your skill at the same time. And also, the other piece, I'd almost say is like the mindset type is like, begin to realize how doable this is, then those things all start to build on each other and add to each other. And then as you're taking each of those small steps, it just starts compounding in, you know, opportunities start to come in, that you just wouldn't have imagined before, and it starts to grow a little bit exponentially. And I can see that that's going to happen for you, too. So I'm really excited for you. This is gonna be cool. And even if, I don't know, even if two years from now, or something like that you decide photography is not the thing for you, I think what you have done this type of process in from being intentional to taking small steps to be able to make it happen can be duplicated with just about anything that anybody could want to do.

Mark Sinclair 33:25
Yeah, I completely agree with that. I completely agree.

Scott Anthony Barlow 33:29
So, oh, go ahead. What were you gonna say?

Mark Sinclair 33:33
I'm gonna say, leader photography, we try to make it. We involve the whole family as well, because my big endgame of doing the photography was, I want to be around, fully seen the kids grow up as much as I can. So working for myself would be fantastic. Being able to have flexibility. That was one of my number one. Things that are right down, say, we're involving the family regarding our taken trips, and everyone's getting involved again, that gets everyone on side as well. So it's when the kids were going out exploring the area we live in, we've been in for 18 months, there's a lot to discover.

Scott Anthony Barlow 34:17
Yeah. That's been huge for me. That was a big motivator for me too. I mean, now and this is my second business, had another one back in college days and everything along those lines, too. So this not necessarily my first rodeo. But like when Alyssa and I went to decide on the second business, one of our big intentions was, hey, we both wanted to be at home. We just brought her home. And she got to be at home for a couple of years to be able to spend with the kids. Because we ended up like paying off all our debt and getting rid of all our bills and everything else and it just got entirely possible to go completely without her income, but then it's like, hey, how do we get me home too, and being able to help other people in a way that made sense so that we can be at home spend time with our kids. And like yesterday Alyssa got to go to, yeah, got to take our daughter to go do something fun with her and her daughter. And then I got to go take our two boys to the coffee shop. And before I dropped him off at school, and it's just little things like that, that I never ever, it just wasn't even possibility before because I had to go and be someplace else. So I totally know what you mean. And I commend you, sir, for looking that far ahead, realizing that that's part of something that you want, and then actually taking steps to move down that path. Because that in itself is not easy, and most people are not going to do that. And I am just thoroughly impressed with what you've done already. That's why I think that there's big things to come for you.

Mark Sinclair 35:57
You know, sincerely, I hope so.

Scott Anthony Barlow 36:03
Yes, I bet. So kind of where you're at right now, and you're really just getting into the thick of it. But you've also overcome some of the hurdles that people never get past in just even moving forward in the first place, what advice would you give to people for jumping into those first hurdles? So other listeners of the podcast, you know, you've been one yourself, you were in this place not that long ago. But for all those HTYCers, that are listening out there that want to take those first steps and want to even get clarity and figure it out, like what advice would you give them to build start moving down the same path?

Mark Sinclair 36:45
I would say my biggest single bit of advice is overcome your mental barriers, find a way that works for you to do that, because that's the single biggest inhibition or believe that I faced. Once you believe in yourself, you say that anything's possible.

Scott Anthony Barlow 37:06
It really is like, I know that sounds like overly simplistic, but I agree with what you said. You mentioned a couple of them earlier, but I'm super curious then, Mark, what did you feel like were the very biggest mental barriers? And then how... what did you specifically do to get past them?

Mark Sinclair 37:31
Okay, so one of my, back probably a couple of months, well, I've been a lot more active taking more photos. And my fear of is my work good enough. So what I've done, I've joined a couple of local photography, Facebook groups, which range from beginner to professional, and I'll start posting in there to get over my fears of, you know, either public and a lot more work or what are they think of it. Am I going to get torn to shreds, criticized and none of that's happened, people have been very helpful, constructive criticism. There's some great photographers in their and I earned that very helpful. You start, it's like a little community, you stand to gain to see people out in the rocks in the morning, taking the sunrise pictures, and that to me just hanging around these guys and posting photos where they do and just little things like that. And it kind of made me feel accepted. And I can do it. I'm not at that level yet but it's something to aspire to. And yeah, that's been my single biggest thing, actually being afraid to showcase my work.

Scott Anthony Barlow 38:47
That's interesting. Because, I mean, in varying degrees, and I think it depends on you know, different craft or different skill or different profession or whatever it might be. It all kind of comes back to that same thing of, "is it good enough? Am I good enough? Can I get good enough? I don't have the experience, don't have the knowledge, don't have the..." I don't know, whatever it might be. Don't have this, and that's what we have a tendency to focus on. But it really, I mean, I know we talked about the photography club, and that sounds like such a simple thing. But I want to kind of uncover that for just a moment cuz it really seems like what that did for you was it sort of forced you into this different environment where now you kind of had to behave a little bit differently and that allowed you to put yourself out there in a way that was, I'm going to call it more safe because it sounds like you were expecting the worst, right? And the worst never happened.

Mark Sinclair 39:49
Yeah, that's pretty much it. My brains always go on, well, what's the worst that could happen? And that was another one of the exercises from figure out what fits, once you realize what the worst that can happen, it's not really that bad. In the big scheme of things, it might knock you back for a minute or two but it's not a biggie.

Scott Anthony Barlow 40:10
Yeah, plus the worst that can happen usually never happens, right? I mean, it can, but it usually never does. So...

Mark Sinclair 40:18
Exactly, I've not found it to happen yet. So I've just been pleasantly surprised every step of the way. So...

Scott Anthony Barlow 40:26
Well, that's kind of a nice bonus, actually, now that I think about it, if you're planning or you're like really exploring what's the worst that could happen. And then when it's way better than that, what actually happens then is like, oh, this is great.

Mark Sinclair 40:36
Fantastic.

Scott Anthony Barlow 40:39
Oh, my goodness, that is absolutely fantastic. I so appreciate you being generous with your time and taking the time, making the time to come on, and have this conversation and share with others and even getting further outside your comfort zone. Because you told me "Hey, I've never been on a podcast before this can be my first time." And I think you sent Alyssa an email that said, "Hey, I'm probably going to be a little bit nervous about this." And I think you did fine. And I really, really appreciate it. And I think that people are going to love this because it's so recent, and so raw.

Mark Sinclair 41:16
Appreciate you giving me the opportunity to share a bit of my story, and I bet it's useful.

Scott Anthony Barlow 41:23
Absolutely. And hey, really, really good to connect to you at the end this way, I don't always get the opportunity to have, you know, these longer conversations with our customers and our listeners. So I really value this too, in that way. So thanks, man. If there's anything I can ever do, don't hesitate to give me a shout. I appreciate it.

Mark Sinclair 41:43
Thank you very much, Scott.

Scott Anthony Barlow 41:53
Hey, I hope you love that episode with Mark Sinclair, the HTYCer listener to this show, and much much more. He's going on a trajectory that is going to be a lot of fun for him and his family. Plus, it's going to, I'm sure, have twists and turns that he does not even expect yet. And I'm really excited for him. Plus kudos to him for getting way outside his comfort zone and coming on a show like this. That's awesome. So I've got much respect for the guy. So if you want to do some of the same things that he did, here's what I would suggest. I would suggest that you get started by our eight-day free mini course and determine, hey, you know, do you even want to move down the path of really figuring out what... and being intentional about what you want to do in your life. And that'll give you a taste of that. And then if you want to dive in, and go much, much deeper, well, you can explore the same type of thing that Mark did with figure out what fits, or we've got lots of other ways that we can help you. But you've got to take the first step just like Mark. So take that first step and go over to figureitout.co that's figureitout.co or you can text HTYC to 38470. And we'll get you started. So that's not all though, because I want you to hear what's coming up next week on the Happen To Your Career podcast, we have a guest and I get to have a conversation with somebody who works with a company that I highly respect. And we've talked a lot about before on this show and at the same time, she's been able to, oh, how shall we say it, she's been able to act as if in order to move her career along. So take a listen to what's next week on the Happen To Your Career podcast.

Christy Wright 43:53
With this unbelievable, powerhouse entrepreneurial survivor mother, step into your gifts, and unapologetically kind of make your way in like doing something that you love. And you really can make money doing what you love. You just need a lot of time, a little bit of help to overcome those hurdles.

Scott Anthony Barlow 44:12
If you've ever thought about starting a business, or if you've ever thought about doing work that's unapologetically you then you have to tune in next week to our conversation with Christy Wright. We'll see you then. Thanks so much for taking the time, making the time and listening to our show. I sincerely appreciate it because I know your time is valuable. And I enjoy you spending it with us. All right, we'll see you next time. Adios. I'm out.